CGPersia Forums
Release Blog CGPeers IRC Chat FAQ
Go Back   CGPersia Forums > Off Topic > CG General Discussion
Reload this Page 2014 - The End of Softimage
CG General Discussion General discussion related to computer graphics and the CG industry

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-05-2014, 04:38:49 PM   #151
ill_bet
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 106
Thanks (Given): 101
Thanks (Received): 22
Link(s):
 
is Online  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 08:10:02 PM   #152
Acido
Acido's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 250
Thanks (Given): 43
Thanks (Received): 36
They never push development, neither market Softimage; so it's not the software fault, it's Autodesk fault not to sell a lot of seats. They didn't care since the acquisition.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
1 Thanks, 0 Dislike - jakoo thanked for this post
Old 03-06-2014, 08:08:48 AM   #153
prezadent
prezadent's Avatar
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,132
Thanks (Given): 946
Thanks (Received): 2510
LOL, some moron has done changed the wikipedia page to refer to Softimage in the past tense...
"Autodesk Softimage, or simply Softimage /sɒftɨˈmɑːʒ/ was a high performance..."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SoftimageXSI
__________________
"That's What." -She
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 02:13:30 PM   #154
znix
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 48
Thanks (Given): 41
Thanks (Received): 4
Upcoming MMO Wild-Star is made with Softimage/XSI. Anyone check out the awesome facial animations in their promo movies? They kick serious ass.

Here is one:
Link(s):
 
More:
Link(s):
 
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 05:58:31 PM   #155
skoozdog
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 41
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 1
You finally really did it!.....You Maniacs! You blew it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 06:06:32 PM   #156
ghaffar
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 22
Thanks (Given): 1
Thanks (Received): 0
hi guys...
i know that's not place for this type of post..
but i want to help from of you guys.. my mind is little bit scattered because i am motion graphic artist and i want to do some character animations in my motion graphic work...
i am 3d max artist since 4 or 5 year.. i have learned maya also to fill my gape an develop my skills but...
now i cant find out right way and right choice for me..
when i saw some 3d motion graphic works on vimeo which is done by cinema 4D ... i loved it and it becomes my passion to do this type of work..
plz suggest me that what is better and good app for 3d motion graphic and character animation and also character rigging too...
some times i try to do some stuff like cinema 4d.. in 3ds max but i am not good in 3ds max and maya also ..
now i have take decision to shift my tools in cinema 4D...
please suggest me that what is better for me...
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 06:15:46 PM   #157
Crackhead
Crackhead's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 122
Thanks (Given): 29
Thanks (Received): 31
Link(s):
 
Ironically this was Softimage - excellent for both character animation (they just finished The Lego Movie with it) as well as motion graphics and commercials. See this: https://vimeo.com/groups/softimagetu...ideos/81081389

Autodesk are retarded - they killed the most techy app in their portfolio because it wasn't as popular as the other two.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 06:16:53 PM   #158
skoozdog
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 41
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 1
well this has been coming for a long time, the biggest alarm bells started when Arnold wasn't released on Sofimage before a Maya version was sorted, as it is in my belief that pressure was applied of some sort by Autodesk to stop this happening because sales of softimage would have shot up and adversely affected sales of Maya. And to make an excuse and kill it instead of selling it is just criminal.

I only wish Autodesk had sent me some makeup, because I like to look pretty before I get fucked in the ass!

Autodesk are the Mob! fuck them! they will never get another penny from me again.

Crackhead it only became less popular when Autodesk got hold of it and buried it on their website.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 06:29:53 PM   #159
smilerpersia
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 79
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 6
3dsmax looks like a cobbled together hodge podge mess in comparison to softimage, but that's Autodesks baby so it's safe.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 07:33:55 PM   #160
IN10Se
IN10Se's Avatar
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,328
Thanks (Given): 151
Thanks (Received): 1681
Link(s):
 
It is retarded keep a piece of software that canīt make enough money sustain it self - else Autodesk wouldnīt kill it!
The development of Softimage probably reached the point where the cost more money than they make.
is Online  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 08:02:18 PM   #161
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Link(s):
 
lol 3dsmax its next just wait
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 09:06:27 PM   #162
soundview00
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 520
Thanks (Given): 383
Thanks (Received): 77
It's not the software fault, AD never really pushed Softimage the way it pushed Maya and Max. Softimage was great when AD aquired it, and it still great years later. If you look at it, AD never really had to tinker with Softimage with service packs, but they sure as hell service pack Maya to death. Point is, Softimage was/is a solid performer that trumps the raw performance of Maya any day. I think that it will continue to grow even after AD stops developing newer releases. Could you imagine Softimage XSI being used for the next 5-10 years...it is multithreaded you know, and Maya needs a complete viewport rewrite to even catch up.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kR7UWImpG54

Last edited by soundview00; 03-07-2014 at 09:13:15 PM.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2014, 09:22:04 PM   #163
berdinatilli
berdinatilli's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 808
Thanks (Given): 678
Thanks (Received): 1620
Link(s):
 
*message deleted*
___

nvm, i was going to give a long answer to that, but its too much trouble.

best is to leave the dreamers dream.
__________________
dont be shy, press the thx button
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 12:19:14 AM   #164
patv3d
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 2
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 0
This decision is complete horseshit. Softimage is by far the best tool for 3d production. I was trained on Maya and I do some of my FX work in Max. For commercial animation production Softimage destroys everything. Softimage has been the primary software in our pipeline. We don't plan to switch anytime soon to the piece of shit known as Maya. XSI until we can't. I need ICE for my FX work, anything other right now is a major step backwards. Houdini will be my alternative to keep quality and time tables reasonable. I hope Soft gets sold to the Foundry So we can finally slap the shit out of Autodesk.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 12:42:54 AM   #165
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Link(s):
 
the same reaction of xsi users,denial,its not a dream i dont care whats happen to max if got better or worse all i know its that the development of max follow the same pattern as Xsi,you cant sell max to maya users but sure you can do the opposite,in this case its not about user base,its about how you can cut cost.

Just wait

Last edited by Georgeivan; 03-08-2014 at 05:33:58 AM.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 05:32:48 AM   #166
Sproxar
Sproxar's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,837
Thanks (Given): 2073
Thanks (Received): 2000
Link(s):
 
I figured I'd beat radoman to the punch...

Link(s):
 
__________________

doing my part to make the world a better place... one post at a time.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 06:29:10 AM   #167
radoman
radoman's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,945
Thanks (Given): 5245
Thanks (Received): 5770
??????
for you Spoxar
Link(s):
 
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
1 Thanks, 0 Dislike - Sproxar thanked for this post
Old 03-08-2014, 08:35:53 AM   #168
ridgecity
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 7
Thanks (Given): 1
Thanks (Received): 1
I changed from maya to Xsi once I started finding problems finishing stuff. Xsi was a peace to cake to work with compared with Maya. Obviously Autodesk just bought it to kill it and own the patents, they will integrate some stuff in the future, but right now, they can't maya and 3d studio are very dated and barely work the same as XSi.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 10:09:37 AM   #169
carinasvendsen
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 140
Thanks (Given): 18
Thanks (Received): 14
Link(s):
 
M&A is basically about borrowing money. And when there are no more companies to buy, you have to lay off people and discontinue products.

It would be interesting to know how many paying Softimage users there are. My guess is that all 3, Max, Maya and Softimage costs more than they earn.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 02:12:07 PM   #170
gedfrost
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 143
Thanks (Given): 59
Thanks (Received): 27
imagine that you are using softimage and now otodesk killing it an offering you to choose between maya or 3ds max. a couple years later otodesk killing 3ds max and offering you a free maya copy. This would be interesting too
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 02:26:01 PM   #171
soundview00
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 520
Thanks (Given): 383
Thanks (Received): 77
"It would be interesting to know how many paying Softimage users there are. My guess is that all 3, Max, Maya and Softimage costs more than they earn."

Speak for yourself.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 02:29:02 PM   #172
smilerpersia
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 79
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 6
I don't see why softimage would cost them much to maintain, Autodesk added almost nothing since they got it.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2014, 04:06:34 PM   #173
SmokeMe
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 325
Thanks (Given): 205
Thanks (Received): 100
Link(s):
 
No they wanted to rape it, then kill it.

---------- Post added at 03:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:58 PM ----------

Link(s):
 
AD are in a catch 22 with Max and Maya, Maya has the defacto standard for movies and Max has the biggest user base. Neither of these 2 things applied to Softimage unfortunately.

This was always going to happen and XSI was the weaker of the 3 as a brand and business, not as software. AD will obviously take as much of the good stuff of XSi and put it into Max/Maya, ie ICE.

At some time in the future AD will have to revisit this and maybe dump another.

I just hope AD don't get SideFx, Houdini is streets ahead of anything AD has, its just Houdini's modeler is a PITA.

---------- Post added at 03:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:03 PM ----------

Link(s):
 
Who know's, maybe, but it has a bigger user base than Maya, of course AD will have to work out who this user base is and who it serves.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 11:13:19 AM   #174
Kakkoii
Kakkoii's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 441
Thanks (Given): 50
Thanks (Received): 202
Link(s):
 
Maya's professional, paying and student userbase is larger than Max's.
__________________

is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 02:20:40 PM   #175
vladv
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 175
Thanks (Given): 1
Thanks (Received): 44
Link(s):
 
No. Max's user base is still several times bigger than Maya's. Though he couldnt give out any numbers, that's something that K. Pimentel confirmed on CGTalk when he still was on Max dev a couple of years ago.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 03:10:58 PM   #176
Crackhead
Crackhead's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 122
Thanks (Given): 29
Thanks (Received): 31
Popularity for Autodesk's 3d apps seems to be inversely proportional to quality, which is weird given the fact that the prices are pretty similar. I know this is a recent fact, but still... piracy was high even from the inception of the internet therefore price is irrelevant for a lot of users.
Humans are stupid.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 03:27:18 PM   #177
trayser
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 417
Thanks (Given): 20
Thanks (Received): 85
In a way I do understand them, keeping 3 applications running that all do more or less the same thing in different ways isn't really a good business. They most likely hoped that softimage would compete with houdini but it failed to do so, it never got used as the "go to app" in the movie industry and then they didn't know what to do with it.

Maya is tightly integrated into the pipelines and it is available on all platforms, widely used for movies and games.

Max is tight with the architectural community and has the larger portion of gamin industry.

Softimage isn't tight with anything, just a bit here and there and even if it is better (haven't used it for a while so I can't say) than anything else it won't survive without a big userbase, not just a small but steady fanbase. What we can hope is that they will take the good stuff out and integrate with maya, yes I think maya will make most sense since it is more for the movie part of things so a thing like ice would help out with sfx scenes.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 03:47:44 PM   #178
Crackhead
Crackhead's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 122
Thanks (Given): 29
Thanks (Received): 31
Link(s):
 
You're rambling.
Adsk purposely didn't advertise Softimage (almost never in their promos or their front pages, articles, etc.) because they bought it with the intent to kill it from the start. As a result, of course it didn't grow in popularity.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 04:06:38 PM   #179
soundview00
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 520
Thanks (Given): 383
Thanks (Received): 77
Crackhead is right. If you had a product that was doing bad and not selling as many seats as you would like, then wouldn't you as a business ramp up your promotional team to gloat about how good your product is and what it could do for you? AD never did that with softimage. If they did, then they didn't promote XSI enough. Instead, they demo'd the shit out of Maya and Max...check your local Youtube channels and Google AD and XSI. Point is, they never intended to make XSI a greater package, instead, they just wanted to take what they could from it and incorporate it in Maya and Max...you just wait.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2014, 05:23:27 PM   #180
danfuerth
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 702
Thanks (Given): 36
Thanks (Received): 272
Now you guys believe me????

There is no conspiracy theories, only money.

Every company has done these things.

Microsoft
Apple
Dell
HP
ATI
AMD
Intel
IBM
NEC
Canon
Sony
Samsung


The mentality of competition these days is not to invest in R&D in order to make better products, it is now to buy up the competing companies and take out their patents, then slowing let the product die.

The case of Crapple is a fine example. They got their ass spanked by being forced to switch to intel, as soon as they were forced to do that, they started to winding down their desktops pro apps and all the mac pro's

The reason they did that was that now on Intel hardware they had lost their hardware monopoly that they had with using IBM hardware.

Yuy guys have no idea what IBM did for us by killing apple's hardware monopoly. IBM opened up everything for us,

from 2002 to 2007 it was a very slow and dark period in the computer software and hardware world.
Apple was the game and everyone was catering to them


Now all video is open, all audio is open

We have dozens of graphics apps
We have more than 20 daws to choose from
We have many NLE( video editor packages) to choose from
We have many FX compositing apps to choose from

ALL THIS WAS NOT THERE when Apple was controlling the content editing tools ( by using their hardware monopoly) from 2002 to 2007

After the Intel switch you now are not shakled by Apple's monopoly anymore

THANK GOD IBM got the console cpu contracts and told Apple to go somewhere else.

Imagine if IBM had not done that......
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 11:15:20 AM   #181
carinasvendsen
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 140
Thanks (Given): 18
Thanks (Received): 14
Link(s):
 

Link(s):
 
It wasnīt there because it wasnīt there, thereīs no big conspiracy there. Itīs like saying we had no 24Megapixel digital cameras back in 2002 because Kodak controlled the market and didnīt want any competition selling 135film.

No, we had no 24Megapixel digital cameras 2002 because they had not yet been developed (no pun intended).
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 01:15:44 PM   #182
whimp
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 2
I love the internet, it seems Autodesk has a lot of ceo's and they all have an opinion. Unfortanaly for all softimage fans that seems to be suprised to see that after his release they dont develop it any futher. I never worked with softimage and it has no real selling points for me, except ice maybe. People claims to always have known this would happen, if they really believed there own words they should have switched to another program, perhaps like blender or houdini, because Autodesk is a bad company with a strategy you can rely on. According to the reactions here they didnt do that. You cant blame Autodesk for that. In my opinion autodesk is marktleader for modelling/animating. However, if your company relies on softimage in the workflow, you have to adapt. That is what new technology is all about, adapt or die.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 01:44:20 PM   #183
desnos
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 130
Thanks (Given): 51
Thanks (Received): 8
i have learn xsi 5 y s ago,
is the strongest , now i dont like maya
i think so , we must wait but autodesk is doing some thing bad for itself
from ash of xsi will born something
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 03:18:35 PM   #184
Crackhead
Crackhead's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 122
Thanks (Given): 29
Thanks (Received): 31
Link(s):
 
If an amazing workflow (great tools allover the place, amazing easiness of use and powerful in the same time, not the clunky and backwards program that Maya is - I've worked with 3dsMax, Maya and Softimage) is not a selling point for you then, OK.
In retrospect perhaps it's better that you didn't worked with it because now you'd be very pissed to lose such a tool.

Link(s):
 
Yes, a turd. That's the only thing Autodesk is capable of when it comes down to innovating.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 03:38:59 PM   #185
muchograndes
muchograndes's Avatar
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 2,018
Thanks (Given): 730
Thanks (Received): 390
autodesk much like adobe, are generally too big for there own good. they buy stuff and it goes to shit. Especially Load times. I don't understand why load times grow so drastically. 2009 loads in like 30sec. 2014 takes atleast 5 minutes.

same happened when adobe bought macromedia. Flash and dreamweaver used to install in 3 mins and launch in seconds. Then adobe bought them and you have to sit and watch them install and then sit and watch them load.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 04:11:00 PM   #186
EndEd
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 0
this is hillarious

---------- Post added at 03:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:10 PM ----------

Link(s):
 
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 05:16:05 PM   #187
softimagexsi
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 118
Thanks (Given): 33
Thanks (Received): 44
Link(s):
 
Beside very few things ( bugs, minor fixes and some ICE nodes ) they did nothing to improve Softimage

They killed Softimage because they wanted to push both 3DS and Maya...no wonder why they created Maya Lite for game development instead of Softimage ( which for years had tools made for game development )

This is a huge F you to all users, a huge F you to all the things that recently have been done with it
Peta commercial, Lego movie, Elysium scenes and many many many more

They saw that Softimage was gaining a lot and tools developed with it could solve so many problems in pdocution pipelines, while in Maya and 3DS they are always banging their head to find a proper solution

Autodesk didn't simply killed a great software, they killed the future, because as it is right now, Softimage is still years ahead both Maya and 3DS...

Its not perfect and in some areas Maya is the winner, but overall they prefered to push the dead horse instead of thevast superior Softimage

I really hope they crash and burn, because they totally deserve it

PS: Now they've changed their policy, you can still purchase subscriptions for Softimage 'till 2016

AD you're a joke

Edit: If I remember correctly the team behind Softimage was around 10-12 people...how much cost would be 10-12 people for a company like AD? c'mon!!!!
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 07:00:05 PM   #188
whimp
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5
Thanks (Given): 0
Thanks (Received): 2
Good to know that softimage is lightyears ahead, so with th 2015 version you should be fine until lets say 2020?
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2014, 07:13:48 PM   #189
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Move one guys,its just another app,some love it beacuse they can get away in jobs stealing compounds,pretending they are TDs,you can do the same on Maya with Python(but of course you need to know what you are doing),if not move to Houdini.

For poly work it can be replaced with Modo or even with Maya/Max

Its funny that people get angry now,Xsi was dead long time ago.

AD will no crash and burn becasue Xsi,talking about money Xsi was the dead horse.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
1 Thanks, 0 Dislike - arvmetal thanked for this post
Old 03-10-2014, 07:15:27 PM   #190
softimagexsi
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 118
Thanks (Given): 33
Thanks (Received): 44
If AD seriously starts to make Maya less paifull to work with, regarding custom tools mostly and overall some of the stunning features of Softimage, and thinking maybe to implement something similar to ICE ( Bifrost maybe? ), I'll give Maya a go.

The main problem related to Softimage right now is that, if you want to work in a studio or you want to get inside the CG industry, if you're using just Softimage you're screwed, so you're forced to move towards Maya/Modo/Houdini.

Personally I've developed my own pipeline using Softimage, and I can work with it for another 3-5 years, while in the meantime learn slowly Houdini or Maya

Anyway yes, Softimage is waaaay ahead of Maya and 3DS, but those two were always the standard and Softimage didn't get so much attention unfortunately ( except in recent years, lets say since Softimage 6-7 ), where it became known, but not as Maya and 3DS.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 04:18:11 AM   #191
szron
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 13
Thanks (Given): 30
Thanks (Received): 0
finally, they buried a corpse. better late than never. adding three bugfixes every year and making xsi folk rage was just an unbearable trolling
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 04:23:22 AM   #192
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Link(s):
 
Marcus already said that bifrost runs outside Maya,its not inside, imho something like Ice will be on Maya on a future.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 05:07:06 AM   #193
Ironman
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 62
Thanks (Given): 18
Thanks (Received): 6
For someone like Georgeivan, if you dont understand why softimage user is angry then at least you have the courtesy to keep the mouth shut and not pretending than you understand. For someone who not using crack version and invested in it is a different story. Pirated user will never understand this, they got the software for free and ditch the software easily or leave it install in the PC without doing anything.

For autodesk it is so funny that they claimed removing softimage is to help max and maya while they will port all of the ICE function to that. It seems to me the problem is not the softimage but maya and 3dmax instead. Softimage obviously has smaller userbase, that's why the decision it is very obvious. It will be a different story if Softimage has a large userbase.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 05:34:32 AM   #194
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Well i really understand dude,im not the moron trowing money at AD,Softimage users have what they want a foot in the ass(AD was doing this since acquisition,but looks like SI users need the food very deep to notice something),next shit storm will go to Max users,those eat shit like no other user base,they are happy about a layer manager.

Eventually all will go to Maya,of course they wont let you know if they want to kill the thing,they are not like his costumers,i mean retarded.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 05:50:41 AM   #195
Ironman
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 62
Thanks (Given): 18
Thanks (Received): 6
Cool if we understand each other, i know couple of people will be heavily affected by this and they are investing in this for long time and the way they work really tied up to Softimage. They have reach 50s and it is not easy for them to start all over again. It will affected their life, there is a collateral damage done which AD knows and doesnt care.

In my opinion I dont think max is going away, it heavily rooted on Architectural work. They have done the damage for XSI, i can tell user is not looking at max nor maya, a lot looking at houdini now, trying to avoid AD as much as possible. If they kill 3dsmax in the future, their userbase will eventually shrink much more further.

They can afford to throw away software that has small user database. Users are the key and answer, more user more power. This is all financial business decision. Softimage user shrunk when Aliaswave front Maya 1.0 released loongg ago. That's when they start to lose user and their cameback which ported from DOS to Window version (Sumatra and eventually XSI) is taking sometimes to catch up. Anyone who has been this industry long enough knows perfectly about this. But in piracy world, user doesnt care about this because they dont invest in it.

Last edited by Ironman; 03-11-2014 at 05:56:00 AM.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 09:20:01 AM   #196
softimagexsi
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 118
Thanks (Given): 33
Thanks (Received): 44
Agree with Ironman, unfortunately there are people 45-50 years old who developed all their tools using Softimage, and they're not so happy to switch to another software after all those years.

"Change" is a part of the industry, the more you go forward the more things will eventually evolve, so from one side you should be prepared to "update yourself" in order to keep up with all those changes

I would be completely happy if those changes help me evolve as an artist, by giving me more efficient tools and a better pipeline which can be used in different projects....and that is the main point

The change here is not going to "evolve" yourself as an artist, but it'll take you a step backward, by giving you obsolete tools compared to what you already use on a daily base

For someone who's not familiar with XSI pipeline you could think that I'm just an angry fanboy who's really pissed off because they shut down my favourite software, but in reality I thought for a very long time to switch to Maya, because of "market reason" ( e.g. finding a job requiring Maya is easy ), and I'm talking from a point of view of an ex-Max user.

I throw away Max 10 years ago, because I couldn't wrap my head around a software so clunky, which works properly only with a ton of plugins, and whos animation pipeline is dreadful and painfully slow.
Started using Softimage, it took quite a bit ( 6 months ) to fully understand its potentials, and from there I never looked back.
As said, for commercial reason in the meantime I was looking at Maya as well, and I did a kind of face off between the two software, in order to check which one was the fastest and most important better solution pipeline-wise, in order to give me best results and being able to re-use those tools for various projects, which is a massive time saver.
Except for some specific areas, where Maya does a pretty decent job, I mostly spend less time achieving perfect results using Softimage, while in Maya things were always not 100% satisfying

Don't get me wrong, I think Maya was and always be one of the most used software around, thanks to Pixar and all the other companies that developed their work around it...
But, if I need to completely re-organize my pipeline because of corporate decision, I prefer to switch to something better than the software I'm using, not going backwards...

Sorry for the long post....everyone knew why AD bought it....but holy fuck, I din't expect this massive F You, especially to long time users....small userbase? yes, but they're people who work hard and did impressive things

Thank god I postpone my decision to buy Softimage in 2012!
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 10:27:40 AM   #197
carinasvendsen
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 140
Thanks (Given): 18
Thanks (Received): 14
Link(s):
 
Whatīs stoping them from continuing using Softimage?
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2014, 02:21:47 PM   #198
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Bugs... bet you ass AD will leave a couple of them on 2015,developer can be nice but until they hit a wall.

It dosent matter that Max have the biggest user base,if you need to make more proffit what you do? you cant simply kill Max,you can simply kill Maya,Maya users will have no use for Max,Max users on the other hand can be moved to Maya,polygon tools on Max are the same ,Maya got more development than Max now,in mean in poly tools.
Maya LT its for games now,remember Gmax?

I perfectly understand the angry but many people see this coming,im on my 30-40 and i know that constant learning its part of this job,i dont work in Hollywood(well sort of but im not there in person and all people i met know this,you dont need to invest money to loose,time its all we got,even people not buyin the tool loose time.

But imho its not a total loose,thanks to Xsi i learn more maths,refresh my knowledge on vectors,and i started to learn Houdini wich its far morepowerfull.
And i can go back to things like Lagoa,nothing prevent to keep using some tools,even if you got no more render engines you can export alembic.
Well nothing you people dont know,the only drawback i see here its time,people on his 50 have to start learning a new tool again,taking time away from their families,but shit happens,in all business,people get fired,at least this industry let you keep working pass your 40's.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2014, 03:07:13 PM   #199
sanjiro666
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 40
Thanks (Given): 7
Thanks (Received): 10
Sad to see Softimage go but to be honest... I dropped it the moment AD picked it up.

A few points for people worried about Houdini.

First small background so you understand the position I am coming from.
I use C4d Lightwave 3DS Zbrush and Houdini, all at least once a week on projects.
I am NOT a VFX artist, I am an illustrator/animator/modeller

Comments I see often about Houdini that I feel are uninformed or just WRONG




1. Modeling
"houdini is %$#$ for poly modeling."


the BAD
Houdini snaps BLOW CHUNKS, I loved Softimage snaps and lightwaves brute force for polies.
Houdini is NOTHING like any other modelling tool you have used (unless you modelled in ICE rofl)

the GOOD
Everything else
Once you wrap your head around modelling in Houdini its pure pain going back to another app
I model faster smarter and with greater flexibility in Houdini than in any other app
Listen to TDs tell you whats so good about Houdini and you will be put off, they code, they script, and lets face it they geek out about stuff that is a pain to most artists.

Give it time... a solid chunk of time and you will see why it rocks.
Give it an afternoon and you will not even get out of the starting gate.




2. Rendering
"Mantra is the slowest renderer out there"

the BAD
Its slow if you want to do a nice simple GI test render of a ball and a box with a HDR light on a flat white table.
SSS, not as good as it could be (13 made some nice improvements)

the GOOD
everything else
I challenge ANYONE with ANY other renderer to pull off flicker free HIGHQUALITY GI (not smushy light blobs that bleed through fine detail) faster than it can be done in Mantra.

When you fail at this throw DOF at it and Mantra pulls ahead
Put in some motion blur and it gets down right embarrassing
then use displacement like its going out of fashion and watch all other renderers fall off a cliff.



Few tricks for those of you that just download the PLE version whack a few things on the stage and render...
Always use the PBR unless you have a very good reason to use something else
the balance between Pixel Samples and Ray Variance AA is critical and you can blow out your render times if you dont know what you are doing (its very peaky)

Simple way to get good result fast.
Pixel samples at 6x6
Max ray at 3
Noise level at 0.01
(there is way more to it that that, but thats a good place to start)


P.S. it will still NEVER beat any other decent GI renderer at a simple test still shot, but thats NOT what its made for
is Offline  
Reply With Quote
1 Thanks, 0 Dislike - RubberVest thanked for this post
Old 03-12-2014, 04:38:09 PM   #200
Georgeivan
Georgeivan's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,800
Thanks (Given): 999
Thanks (Received): 1055
Reality its that 99% of people dont have the brain to use it at work,those are the one talking.
is Offline  
Reply With Quote